I want to be able to have my empire center on a single vast city. Like Ankh-Morpork.

This is just a personal thing, but I had my breath taken away by a City in Everquest.

Way back in the good-ol-days, my friend who got me to play was over in Black Burrow but I was over in the Commonlands.

The trip felt like it took weeks. Terrified out of my mind after getting molested in Kithicor due to me being a newb and not knowing about the night and the undead.

Long story short, seeing Qeynos after all of that work was the most beautiful city I've seen in a game. Probably just from the releif and the triumphant music that played when I zoned in

To make cities unique, it would be worth looking into some geographically specific buildings, Buildings for swamps, for deserts, for forests, for mountains and plains.

More so I think it also should be important that certain cities be allowed to develop into legends in their own right, perhaps a town becomes famous for its fine quality armor.

One last point and all of these were touched on by Cauldyth is that some settlements should stay small.   Not every town should become a thriving metropolis.

From roots RPG-land, I really admired Lankhmar, City of Adventure, and City State of the Invincible Overlord. After I played some in those settings, I pretty much lost my taste for traditional dungeon-crawling. Those city settings started out with far more atmosphere and topped that off with lots more interaction options for every character type--thieves got chances to be central figures, fighters learned how to do their jobs with no armor and light weapons, mages had to deal with being close to lots of their peers, priests had to deal with their temple hierarchies...

Fond reminiscing aside, I'm with Cauldyth and fairwater in hoping to see the game shape up to make city-spam a thing of the past. That seems to be an essential Step 1 on a path to the goal of making TBS cities memorable. Rich event logging and strong map-level connections to those logs seem like Step 2 (kind of a city version of the way that Judge and Jury setting worked).

The city in Thief: the dark project was very nicely done.  Granted, you never get to see the whole of it, but it was something to experience.  The haunted walled off section especially.  The place seemed properly immense, gritty, and alive.  That is a game I would like to get working properly again!

Thinking this over more, I think RPG cities become memorable due to three factors.

1. Familiarity. Since this is a turn based strategy I think this work will pretty much be done for you, since you'll be "revisiting" cities every few turns to change production orders and such.

2. Individuality. You can't really become attached to a particular city unless it's somehow different from other cities. This is a tough one and I can't think of any way to achieve this without a lot of extra work from you guys. I like the idea one of the posters had about geographically dependent buildings. A city near a forest might have a lumber mill. One near a mountain might have a quarry. You could even go even farther with this, with the entire city having different graphics depending on where it's founded. A city near a forest will mostly be wooden. If lots of stone is available the buildings will be made of that. Near a flood plain? Mud brick cities.

This would be even better if there were emergent properties that made a city more individual if time goes on. City attacked by a necromancer? Perhaps it becomes haunted afterward. City produced a military unit that went on to have an obscenely high kill count? Maybe they built a monument to their soldiers.

3. It should feel alive. This is another tough one, but perhaps not as hard as number 2. One of the best things about the Sim City series of games in my opinion is that you really get the feeling people are living in these cities. There's traffic. People on the sidewalks, car accidents, helicopters and planes, ships. This was also a fun thing in The Elder Scrolls series. In Oblivion people went about their daily lives all around you. Morrowind was more static, but it was still fun to see how different quests intertwined with each other, and in my first playthroughs I always enjoyed hearing the local rumors. Give me traffic in cities. Wagons loaded with trade goods entering the city gate. Let me see people working. I always enjoyed how you could watch your peons go about their various duties in the Age of Empires series' bases.

This can tie into number 2. If your town has a lumber mill, it would be nice to see them actually felling trees and cutting up logs. Maybe it's an industrial town? If it is, I want to see haze rising from all the forges, and hear hammers ringing when I zoom in. If it's a military base, you should be able to see men drilling in formation.

Like I said, a lot of this is gonna be extra work on your part, but it's nice to dream.

The greatest rpg city of all time is Sigil, of "Planescape Torment" fame! No other city in any game has ever come close to the depth of exploration to be had in it. Every five steps was another interesting character with another unique sidequest. Random attacks from street thugs, crowds of different races walking the streets, and the Lady of Pain's shadow looming over everything! Never have I had so much fun exploring every inch of a city before. I've played through the game over a dozen times, and each time I find at least new surprises by playing as a different class with a different alignment and/or party make-up. (And I'm a very thorough player.)

I also loved all of the cities in "Terranigma". Each one was able to be developed from a small village to a prosperous city by your actions. I liked the base you build in "Skies of Arcadia" for much the same reason.

Arcanum's cities are a great example of cities that had a lot of content inside of them.

The Orion system in "Master of Orion 2" was a treat in that it was this great system with an air of mystery to it, and a powerful guardian that let the imagination run wild with what secrets it may have kept from you.

I also have many fond memories of spending idle hours wandering around Kakariko Village in "The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past." I would pretend to be the neighborhood kid doing yard work for the village by slashing the bushes with my sword, or going into the one house that had rupees hiding behind the painting and "robbing" them before running into the patroling guards outside to start a village wide manhunt.

"Chrono Trigger" has so many great moments that I don't even know where to begin. The trial scene is, of course, a very memorable moment that also taught you that your actions can actually have consequences in the game. The Millennial Fair remains special for serving as a great begining and ending to the game. All the little games to play, Gato, and earning those silver points to spend on all the characters' mimics; good times indeed! The exotic Zeal, heroic Guardia Castle of the middle ages, and the uncertainty of that first visit to Medina Village and it's hostile inhabitants; there is no end to the great locales in that game!

I don't have enough time to write about them, but the cities from Fallout 1 & 2 had tremendous amounts of personality to them. I especially liked discovering the power structure in each city. Was there a government of some kind, crime lords, local law, military, anarchy, etc.

I would like to add Pravoca from the original Final Fantasy on the NES. It had pirates.

One of the key things you guys really need to do first off is make a clear distinction between major cities and minor cities. Major cities should be large lively places and all of them should have significant character but a player should only generally deal with a handful in a game no more than a dozen perhaps altogether on the entire map (including major enemy cities) any more and they all kinda just run together. There is simply no way to have a hundred cities on a map and have each one stand out over the course of a single game...

Final Fantasy 7 had the only city I can really remember the name of, Midgar. They portrayed a sense of scale you never really got to see in the game. The city with the amusement park also stands out in my mind for all the mini-games it had.

The cities I remember most fondly though come from the first two Quest for Glory (originally Hero's Quest) games. They were dripping with character from the Sheriff's "Goons" to the street merchants in the Arabian town.

Edit: Adjusted a few details

@BoogieBac, original post

I remember those games well. Good picks if you want to set a point. I could add comments for all of them, but I'll add other picks instead.

- The planet killing city -
Midgar (FF7)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBvnot7pkvg

I doubt that any single video would set the mood the city "Midgar" gives the game, but you should get the idea. It was an "utopia city" designed and built by an immoral company called Shinra. This city is powered by the life force of the planet itself (called mako), and it had a mood both dark and modern. It was large enough to have more than a few adventures in, where in many other games, you tend to have adventures outside the city. The layers, the different sectors, the subway, and even the sewers made the city look big enough to be the "whole game world" for all intents and purposes.

By the time you leave the place, it feels weird to do so. The land becomes greener, and most towns on the "outside" had a more rural feel in comparison. And its influence doesn't end there. I could go on, but I would likely go on and on and on...

- Collatoral Damage -
Kattelox Island (Megaman Legends / Rockman Dash)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjsxT7ygdMk&feature=PlayList&p=F57E23D858462BDC&index=8

The Megaman series are not known to have the best story lines or voice acting (Megaman X 7 was horrible enough that it could kill...), but it does have its moments. Early in the game, the main town in the game comes under siege by pirates. Not only do you have to defeat them, but there is a risk that the fighting will destroy nearby buildings. After all the fighting is finished, you get a side quest to "donate zenny" to rebuild the city.

What should be taken from this is, if you go run and hide so you can drink a potion to recover (or buy a drink from a vending machine), be prepared for your opponent to destroy the town you are to protect when they try to find you. You'll also have to come to terms with the damage caused because of your "heroism".

P.S. I don't think that the Megaman Legends series get nearly enough attention that it deserves.

Ok, so lets really think about this.

Cities need to evolve into their uniqueness.  Factors that could result in that evolution.

Location

• The city is surrounded by a particular resource, (or group there of) therefore it develops affinities for the products of that resource.  Ie.  Famed Armour from a town nestled between a silver and iron mine in the mountains.
• The city is located at critical point on the map.  Ie, a mountain pass, or at the edge of another kingdoms empire.  This could allow for special fortification and buildings that build upon that pivotal location.
• The city is located in a swamp, desert, forest, etc.  There may be a chance that you could build buildings specific to that location.
• The city is located close to a non-playable race that comes to inhabit that city, setting up their quarters/ghettos.  Ie. Ogres move into town.

Events

• As someone mentioned earlier, statues or memorials for great battles.
• Tomb's and think large tombs for past rulers,(the ruler would have to do something momumentous to open up this option).  Ie. Great pyramids of Giza.
• A magical event and the response of the player could make a town unique.  Ie. Opening up a portal to another worldly dimension into the town, and then it becomes sealed off but leaks corruption.
• A city survives some terrible event and is for ever changed.  Ie.   Survives a plague and then dedicates itself to a god of healing.  Or a town is burned to the ground but is rebuilt with the catacombs of the old city beneath for adventures to explore.

Evolution

• This one is fairly obvious, the more you do something in that town the more specialized it will be, if you make all your weapons here, or armour or troops, or grain.  You get the point.
• Cities on boarders could set up smuggling operations, and overtime the city evolves into a den of thieves.
• A city is influenced by the culture of another nation.

These are just some rambling late night thoughts.

It's fun to see many people remember fondly Morrowind cities. I don't. They all looked bland and void to me, with zero characters you could interact with (dialogues are the weak part of Morrowind). I preferred Arcanum because its citizens had day/night schedules, they would talk to you...

Baldur's Gate II's Athkatla was nice too, with its many inns, quests and events waiting for you at every other corner.

Baldur's gate 1 and 2! sigh, I used to spend hours just wondering around and clicking on every thing, pure bliss.

Warder